TEHELKA: And did you see any other things that…basically
how to approach it? Considerable work has been done on the
users side…military…they all liked the product. And they foresee
no problems in it going through. It's the fourth generation.
BANGARU LAXMAN (interrupts): …on Brajesh
TEHELKA: That…that defence people told me, that officers
told me, that bureaucrats also told me this matter.
TEHELKA: Do you see that as…
BANGARU LAXMAN: You see, also there is the PNC
[Price Negotiation Committee]?
TEHELKA: Sir, there is a PNC there but there is lot
of process there before PNC. You know they have to first…evaluation,
and then short-listing, and then the PNC will come. You know,
they are not allowed to…third party inside that…in the evaluation.
That is a…
TEHELKA: Are you experienced with defence matters generally?
BANGARU LAXMAN (nods in assurance): Hmm.
No, my experience is…
TEHELKA: Mr. R.K. Gupta told me on that day, I told
BANGARU LAXMAN: Hmm.
TEHELKA (continues): That through you,
sir, he can break that one. I said, "I don't, I don't want
to…I don't need any third party to meet Mr. Bangaru Laxman
I can go directly to meet Mr. Bangaru." So he asked me 20
lakhs for the meeting to you. I said, "If…but in front of
me I cannot…I can give that money to Mr. Bangaru Laxman in
a party fund." Sir, that, that also I told Satya also we are
ready to give 4 to 5 per cent as commission. [Laxman
nods] Political commission. That other…that we have
to give…rest of that we have to give separate.
TEHELKA: Do we do it with the treasurer? I don't know
how do we proceed in this. Do we wire transfer the money?
BANGARU LAXMAN: Yeah, yeah. I will tell you….
TEHELKA: Do you see any problems in that? I mean, we…we
are not saying that…that this has to happen, in the sense
that it's sacramount. But even if we have a 25 per cent chance,
we're willing to take the risk.
BANGARU LAXMAN (nodding): That's
Tehelka Investigative Team reporter gets a call on his mobile.
He apologises and leaves the room to take the call.]
TEHELKA: So tell me what exactly is the procedure?
If you could just tell me the details.
BANGARU LAXMAN: Look…no. Probably you may be
knowing the procedure better than me.
TEHELKA: Yeah, yeah. That's why I was here. But things
don't move in India without some political….
BANGARU LAXMAN: Yes, that is true, provided….
We shall try to do that…
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): So far we
have been taking the help of Brajesh Mishra to organise this
because Brajesh Mishra is there on a number of committees
apart from Principal Secretary to Prime Minister.
BANGARU LAXMAN: And any defence issues, he is…
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): We normally
turn to him because he has access to the Defence, Foreign
and other related ministries.
BANGARU LAXMAN: But in this you said that somebody…
TEHELKA: Yeah. I don't know how true that thing is.
I mean, it's just that somebody told us. It could be wrong.
We're not sure.
BANGARU LAXMAN: Yes. I will…(nods)
TEHELKA: And basically, is he the only person with
influence? I'm sure you carry more influence than him.
BANGARU LAXMAN: It's like…. No, he deals with
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): And
also conveys the views of the bureaucracy to Prime Minister.
So he is the liaison between the bureaucracy and the Prime
Prime Minister. Okay.
BANGARU LAXMAN: So…therefore, whatever we tell
to Prime Minister, he also normally have a word with Mishra.
BANGARU LAXMAN: And then certain things he will
say that "No, no, you convey this to Mishra…"
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): "…You pass on this
information to Mishra…." That's how things here….
TEHELKA: Okay. So basically he is the lynchpin in all
BANGARU LAXMAN: He is. But I'll find out all
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): But since this
is a…the superior thing, I think they shouldn't have any kind
TEHELKA (completing Laxman's sentence):
Major roadblock on it?
BANGARU LAXMAN: At…in any case, I'll…. What
would be the total worth of the…?
TEHELKA: It could be anything above 200 crores, as
they say. So about 50 million dollars to 60 million dollars.
But then, if you give us the whole order, then that's, like,
much more. It'll go up to, like, 600 [crore], so that
would be about, I guess, 180 million dollars or something.
Two hundred million dollars.
TEHELKA (continuing): That's…that's …it's much
easier for us to transfer funds abroad than deal within India
on a day-to-day basis. So we'll come to know tomorrow or something?
Is there…you don't deal with…. There's a Mr. Ranjan Bhattacharya
also, I'm told. Is he also important?
BANGARU LAXMAN: Well, he is a family member
of Prime Minister.
BANGARU LAXMAN: And…he does something. But these
things I don't think he will get involved.
TEHELKA: Accha. I was told that he's got a…I
mean, lots of projects and all being moved. I don't know how
far it's true….
BANGARU LAXMAN: Maybe. I don't say that he might
be involving himself in many other things. But as far as defence
things are concerned, I don't think he has much.
BANGARU LAXMAN: Somewhat in power projects.
This and that.
TEHELKA: Yeah. I believe in Enron he had a major hand
to play. And would it be like…their accounts, I believe….I
mean which banking nerve centers do you operate in? Do you
use Zurich or which cities do you use?
BANGARU LAXMAN: You have to consult our treasurer
who will be dealing with this.
BANGARU LAXMAN: I will have to find out from
him first. I have taken over recently. I was not dealing with
these matters earlier…
BANGARU LAXMAN (continuing): …when I
was in party. So I will have to check up from him. In such
BANGARU LAXMAN: And so far, you have yet to
start. Certain things are in…still in the pipeline. That through
establish agent who maintains a liaison with the supplier
and also with the government.